Pleasurable Money Podcast Transcription

43 | Queerness, Human Design, & Money with Viola Hug

PODCAST INTRO:

This is the Pleasurable Money Podcast. Hi, I'm Meaghan and I'm the divine alien driving this here spaceship. I'm a pleasurable money coach with over a decade of experience in finance. During that time, I've learned that a mix of systems and spirituality makes a perfect blend. I have helped hundreds of spiritual business owners heal their relationship with money, and I'm here to teach you how to become money's ride or die.

Stop treating money like a booty call using the help of tools like breathwork and pleasure, which will be featured on this podcast and learn from me and other experts about how to own your wealth. Together, we will break down what it looks like to be in relationship with money and to be in full embodiment with your pleasure.

Episode 43 Begins:

Meaghan: Hi, everyone. Welcome back to the Pleasurable Money Podcast. I am your host, Meaghan, and I'm so happy to have you here. I am here with Viola Hug again, and we are gonna talk all things human design. Um, so say hello, Viola.

Viola: Hi, it's good to be back. And I'm so excited because this is a fun topic.

Meaghan: Yeah. So I do have a couple questions before we dive right into human design. And the first question is I've noticed that you've been referring to your baby and to your children as they/them. So I'd love to hear you talk about how you're raising your children non-binary.

Viola: Yeah. Okay. Um, this is kind of, I, I guess like I had my first kid in 2020, and as we know, 2020 was a good year of introspection for a lot of people. [00:02:00] And, um, we are following what's called like gentle parenting and essentially how I describe it, is that respecting our kids and treating them like they're their own human being that deserves respect, and making sure that we're not perpetuating our own triggers onto them and creating an environment where our connection, their emotions and all that kind of stuff is at the forefront of the priority list of things for us.

Um, that's kind of the vibe. And so when we had our first kid in 2020, we, you know, it brought a lot of things to the surface of like, well, how do we wanna raise our kids? And like, what kind of things do we want them to know? And, um, what kind of, in terms of who we're raising them to be, what kind of things do we want to consider?

And at that point I was already, um, like, you know, I was, I was kind of like, I knew [00:03:00] a little bit about the LGBTQ scene, but I didn't know a ton about it because I just never was involved within the community, I guess. Um, even though I, myself am queer, but I just, I I'm in a hetero relationship, you know? And it's like, I just never have been involved in any types of communities, but then at the same time as well, like I had a family member that was in like questioning of their identity.

And, and I was finding myself in a lot of online places where these things were more conversational and I really started questioning the construct of gender and not necessarily from this place of like, well, actually yes, all the places like, fuck the patriarchy. That's what it always comes back to for me.

But. It was just kind of like, I was realizing like, Hey, like a lot of like, obviously there's the common things. Most people know like, oh, you know, boys can wear pink, and girls can play with trucks, but it felt like so much more than that, to me. It felt like how we're [00:04:00] literally like, basically groomed into an identity, um, which also by the way, has what's led me to my own identity shift.

And, you know, I used to be fully like, I'm definitely like identify as a woman, identify as she, her and in the past like six months or so. I'm like, do I? Or is that just what I think I should be identifying as? And so, you know, I had a shift in my own pronouns as well. I used she/they pronouns now, but I, um, then yeah, I started to kind of feel like.

Not only in our own home, like obviously we do the best to provide like a variety of different things to encourage our child to grow into who they want to be versus who, you know, their birth certificate, the sex on their birth certificate kind of thing. Um, but then also it's how people around you treat your child that I found almost like the most disturbing.

And you hear examples of this online, but when I have had my kid, I realize like how true this was. It's like, if they assume it's [00:05:00] a boy, they say they're fast or strong or like clever when they assume it's a girl, they're pretty, they're cute, they're nice, they're sweet. And I just found that like so bizarre and that's just the tip of the iceberg.

Um, but yeah, and so it basically got to the point where I was like, I don't want to. I don't want to be the decider for my child's identity. Like I just don't think that's my role. And when I looked into it, I heard that a lot of people who use gender creative parenting or gender neutral parenting, they, um, you know, will refer to their child as they/them pronouns, do their best to give them a variety of experiences through toys, clothes, whatever it might be.

And then usually when a child is about four years old is usually what I've heard, but it can be three. It can be five, can be a little bit later. They start to come into their own identity and they can actually tell you how they identify. And we actually [00:06:00] use mixed pronouns in our home. We like online and everything.

We only use, um, they/them pronouns for our kids. For our first, we did use, um, gendered pronouns at the beginning, um, but we've changed that now. Um, and just because I just don't think that anybody online needs to know, like, if you wanna comment something about my kids, then their gender is literally not even relevant in my opinion.

Um, so yeah, it was, it was mainly because of that. And so now a lot of our like family, like grandparents and stuff still use gendered pronouns, which is fine because we also have a lot of books that we, you know, are teaching about like pronouns and gender identity. And as well as like all the other things we deem important, like consent and race and emotions and all the different things.

So that's, yeah, that's how we kind of came to this point.

Meaghan: That's so fascinating. What was coming up for me while you were [00:07:00] speaking was I bet like subconsciously if you're using gendered pronouns one way or the other, you are socializing them. It like, even if you have this idea of like, okay, girls can play with trucks, boys can wear pink, you have this subconscious

um, conditioning from when you were growing up and you will push certain experiences onto the child that may be gendered that you have no idea are actually gendered because it's so subconscious and it's so programmed. So I find it fascinating that you're like, kind of almost tricking your brain into being like, okay, we're gonna, we're gonna give them all the experiences because they are a, they/them and they don't, they are neither or both or all, or, you know,

Viola: exactly. Or one or the other, and that's totally fine. Like, they might may identify with the gender of their birth sex, which is cool. Um, they may not, and that's also [00:08:00] cool. Like it, it really doesn't matter. Um, but I, I think regardless of how they end up identifying, they have more of an opportunity to figure out what they actually enjoy, what they like, what their interests are outside of

just like. And we're like, literally not perfect. I feel like it's been easier with our second who's only four months old because I'm like way more involved in this world. I have so much more knowledge and we started that from the beginning already, but, um, like my toddler's only two years and four months old.

And we are very careful, like when we're out and about we, we don't like gender other kids, you know, we always just say, that's a child, that's a kid. Um, and unless someone's specifically telling us what to call their child, like we'll always assume something neutral or especially like you're not in conversation with a lot of kids.

They're just like in the distance and the same with the parents, we don't say mom and dad will say the parent, the guardian, the grown up, like we'll use terms like that. And, um, even with being conscious of doing [00:09:00] that, my child will, my toddler will look through a book and say, that's the mom, that's the dad.

And I'm like, you know, pointing at like a woman looking person and a man looking person. And I, I always say like, why do you think that, you know, what makes you think that? And it's, you know, They're probably right in terms of the context of what, how the book was designed, for example, but it just blows my mind.

I'm just like, wow, there it is just so strong. And it's probably from, you know, there's a couple of YouTube things we watch and, you know, it's most common to hear, um, parents being referred to as mom and dad. And there's obviously characteristics that my toddler's already placing to one or the other. Um, and I just find it fascinating and interesting and yeah, it's cool.

Meaghan: I recently connected with a person who has created a children's book for, uh, using different pronouns in like everyday speech. And so the ZE [00:10:00] pronouns and the XE

Viola: Neo pronouns too. Mm-hmm

Meaghan: and all of those, um, it's called Pinapel and Friends. I'll link it below. I pre-ordered, it pre-ordered it for my God daughter.

She just turned three. And so I'm really excited for her to get that book and cuz I think she's gonna be really into it, her mother's queer. And like, I just think it's gonna be such a beautiful little, uh, addition to their household. So

Viola: That's so cool. Yeah. I have like a ton of book recommendations if, um, anyone's ever interested as well.

Meaghan: yeah. Uh, send them over to me after we talk and I'll, I'll add 'em to the, to the description, but um, I did want to know kind. You mentioned your family members, how has it been introducing this way of referring to your children to them?

Viola: Honestly, like we, it it's like it's situational, I'll say, because the thing is, is that like, they know we refer to our kids [00:11:00] with they/them pronouns. Um, and, um, but we also don't force it upon them as much just because. You know, most of our family, there's only one family member that well, two family members actually, um, that live close by my, my sibling and my mom.

And they're the ones that are kind of mainly involved on a day to day basis. And they're totally respectful. My, my sister actually goes by she/they pronouns as well. And, um, she's one of the like driving forces. Like she's always making sure to get like, she'll buy like a variety of different clothing, like she's really involved.

And she loves that and she's, you know, queer as well. And so it's kind of like fun and cool to have like her as a sidekick and buddy with us and my mom's taken to it so much, you know? Like, she's just like, wow, like you really realize how much conditioning we have and she's finding it so interesting. And she's doing so good as well.

Like, I [00:12:00] mean, I think it's even harder for people that are like, you know, my parents' generation to catch onto these things and she's doing amazing. So she's really respectful for it. And because we move, use mixed pronouns, like often the like gendered pronoun is the default in the home situation, but, um, it's still, we're still really careful of the way that we utilize it and just like always expanding our mind and trying to use, use the variety.

Um, I, myself, I'm probably the best at it, but it's because I'm probably at the forefront of like my interest at it. Um, but then our extended family that live like overseas and stuff like that, we don't, we don't actually talk much about it other than like, when they came to visit, we just told them about the boundaries.

We told them like, you know, and, and we'll like, correct little terms. If they say something that's very gendered, for example, we'll say, or this, you know, we'll give the other option and we'll, we've had miniature conversations, but we haven't actually like told them it's a rule that they can only [00:13:00] use this or that because it just

doesn't feel like we need to, or I don't know. It's just, we haven't got to that point yet.

Meaghan: Well, there are boundaries that you get to set with yourself to protect yourself from others. So it's like you don't always have to be so strict in your rules with people who don't really matter. Not to say that you don't love your family that

Viola: Oh yeah. And the thing is, is that they would absolutely, like, I know they're the type of people that would be con uh, supportive. It would just be like very confusing for them. And it's like, for example, my mom, who's totally supportive and she's like catching on and getting it and everything, now, it still took her like every single time she visits, we, we correct her.

We explain something. We like tell her why we like show her a tiktok, we'll, like, you know, like all these different things. And slowly over time, she like now gets it versus at the beginning, it was just like a choice we made, which felt like, well, why would you make that choice? [00:14:00] And I think that sometimes it's like, when.

When we share that with people that we don't have a lot of interaction with, and we don't have a lot of time to like explain things and show real life examples, it's a lot harder to understand. Um, and even like with, um, my kids' grandparents that visited from New Zealand recently, like we told them before that we have like, they have their own boundaries about their body and they may not wanna hug or kiss.

But then it was really interesting watching it happen in real time, because at the very beginning, the grandparents were like a little bit offended, you know? Not, not like outrightly, but you could tell, they were like, oh, and you know, they even made a comment like, oh, you know, are, are they not liking me or what's going on?

And when we're like, no, no, no, it has nothing to do with that. They just have really strong boundaries boundaries around their bodies. So they're not gonna do it unless they want to. And it's never anything personal. Like they love you just as much. It's just what they feel like in that moment is maybe not be, be a hug.

Right. um,

Meaghan: That's so funny that you say 

Viola: And then once they clicked, because [00:15:00] they saw it happening in real time, it was completely fine, you know, and they were okay with it and they used, you know, they, they learned how to ask the, the questions and all the things, and then it was great. And so I think it's one of those things as well.

It's like, I don't wanna like push something onto them that they may not fully understand, unless it's gonna be in a situation where it's relevant. Like let's say, um, our toddler in a couple years says, Hey, I identify as this pronoun or whatever it might be or they/them then that's when we'd have to have a real conversation about it, because that's when obviously it would be a lot more important that they're respecting our child's identity.

Whereas right now it's like, I don't care if you call them. He, she, she, or they it's like they're learning. They're still discovering. They're they're still playing around with all the different things.

Meaghan: Yeah, my, my best friend, she is also very, um, vocal about her child's boundaries and how it may not like she doesn't have to give hugs and kisses if she doesn't want to. And like, [00:16:00] it's nothing personal, but it's interesting that you say that because, um, yesterday I was in the salon getting my haircut and I was overhearing this conversation and this woman was like talking about how she always makes her, the children that she cares for,

give her love whenever they see the, her. And it just made me feel like really weird. Like I was like, you make them like hug and kiss you. And like, even if they're like in a bad mood, like, I don't know. I was just like, I don't like that. It doesn't

Viola: I don't like that either. And I think, especially once you realize it, you're just like, oh my gosh. why, why have we been raising people like this?

Meaghan: Yeah. And she actually used those words. She was like, I make them give me love. And I was like, I was just, I don't know. It just made me feel weird. I was like, Ugh.

Viola: It's also interesting for our own triggers and stuff, because one, one of the big ones for me was like a feeling that it it's a personal thing, which it never is. They're [00:17:00] kids, you know? And you know, sometimes our toddler will tell, um, my husband that they love him. And other times they'll tell me, and not us both at the same time, sometimes both of us, but not always.

And for us, it's just like reining in the trigger in our own mind of being like, oh, now you are the favorite parent, right? Which we're not like that, but you can't kind of notice that like internal wound of just like.

Meaghan: Yeah, that ego

Viola: And then, you know, they reject you for, for a hug. And my instinct honestly, is to like almost coerce them.

I, I don't do this because I catch myself, but to be like, oh, I really wanna hug. And it's like, no, just leave them. They said, no, it doesn't mean anything personal.

Meaghan: it's like a

Viola: don't wanna hug right now. Yeah. Mm-hmm

Meaghan: a level of manipulation that

Viola: well, when I think about like, you know, uh, I mean trigger warning, but like sexual assault experiences I've had, if I had understood the concept of coercion and manipulation and [00:18:00] those things, I, would've not got myself and ha like, you know, a lot of the things that happened to me wouldn't have happened to me cuz I would've understood boundaries a lot better.

Um, and so I think it's like really important that we understand these things.

Meaghan: Yeah, that that's interesting. My husband and I were just talking about how this podcast that I listened to, one of the women was very much socialized to not give anyone anything that was making her feel uncomfortable. So like, if she was feeling uncomfortable, she did not owe that person any, uh, like politeness or even speaking to them, even looking at them, no smiling, like fuck that all together.

And I told my husband, I was like, I wish I had that. Like, I wish that I had that. Like, you are making me uncomfortable. Therefore I do not owe you anything. Like, like if I

Viola: think politeness is also such a big one too. Like that's something that I'm trying to rework in my brain, because my default is to just be polite to [00:19:00] strangers and awkward situations. Or even if somebody does something like rude to me, I like wanna be polite back. And, um, I heard this thing recently where it was like one of the ways that, like, I can't remember, it was like serial rapist or something like that found as victims was by bumping into people at the grocery store and the ones who apologized and were like, oh, I'm sorry I

did it. Those would be the victim, the ones that didn't, or that were rude or just kept walking or, you know, didn't accept fault for him bumping into them were the ones that he just left.

Meaghan: Wow. Yeah. Well, I mean, growing up in the south, like I'm from Alabama and that shit is like the, the societal norm. Like, if you are rude, like you are an outcast, you know?

Viola: yeah.

Meaghan: Wow.

Viola: Interesting. I know I'm just, it is this. Yeah, [00:20:00] I could go on and on and on. I could go on.

Meaghan: Well, I don't have a great segue from that, but I did wanna talk about your your pay, anything offer, because whenever you posted about like, okay, first of all, the post that really got me was when you were saying that what you pay does not validate what you're getting out of an experience, and also what you pay me does not validate my knowledge, my, my own experience, my, um, creativity, my everything like, like, I think it's so fascinating that we have this kind of one to one relation to money that we're like less money equals less value, more money, equals more value.

And therefore, like as a coach, if you're not getting paid more, then you must not be as valuable. And as a student, if you're not [00:21:00] paying more, the program must not be as valuable. So that to me was just like, and as a money coach thinking, I was like, I was so like, I was kind of upset that I didn't think about it first, but I was like, I was like, man, that is so good.

So I just wanna hear you, like riff on your pay anything offer.

Viola: Yeah, for sure. So, um, I mean money is something that I work with. Um, a lot in my work, you know, like money is, I think one of the main reasons why people like to work with me, um, I really like to these days talk about more the energy and frequency of abundance, because I think it's like, you know, that's really where I, I have my special sauce.

Um, but the, um, concept of money and worth, you know, you hear this talked about a lot. And I know when I started my journey, that was like one of the first things. Oh yeah. Money doesn't equal your worth. Oh yeah. Well, how much you make isn't how worthy you are. But I started to see this almost more as a logical [00:22:00] concept than one that we actually feel.

And one that we actually act out of. Right. Because I don't think there's anything wrong with investing high numbers, making high numbers. In fact, I do, and I have, and, um, charging high numbers like that that's just, it's fine. But my kind of inspiration with this offer, um, for those of you listening, I decided to create a mastermind.

Usually my masterminds are like minimum four figure investments a month, and I, um, just had this inspiration to make it pay anything. And I went through like, It almost like sunk in deeper for me, how important it was for me to do this for myself, as well as the conversations that have been sparked from this, um, after I did it, but it was like, I just knew I had to do it.

And I knew I had to challenge myself and, um, the people who were wanting to work with me and in my world, and it was like, I had to go through this whole process of being like, yeah, but if somebody [00:23:00] paid me a dollar, would I be okay? You know, if somebody paid me $10,000, would I be okay? If somebody paid me $50,000,

would I be okay? Um, and I just had to like, go process that myself. But yeah, what it came down to is exactly what you just said. It's like we have this really brainwashed perspective of money. That it is the, the thing that makes us a valuable coach, a high level coach, a sought after coach, like specifically speaking about the coaching world, but this is relevant in any area of our life.

Um, and then. As a client. I know myself. It's like, I remember when I hired a coach and I think at the time it was like $3,333. And I remember thinking to myself, oh, I can never pay less than that for a coach now, otherwise I'm not upleveling and growing. So when I look for my next coach, I wanted to pay more than that.

And so then I paid 5,000, you know, and then it's like, I just had this like internal narrative that it had to be more, otherwise [00:24:00] it wasn't like as valuable. And if I invested less than that in a one-on-one coach, it was just because, you know, I'd kind of like get in my high horse about it. I'd be like, oh, I'm just like, you know, I was just interested in how they coach or like something like that.

Um, which I like laugh in hindsight, but it's a really real feeling that a lot of people feel and, um, I basically am at this point now where I see these like, um, old paradigm perspectives of money of business of success and how they were truly robbing us from having the full experience of it. I love that you teach money and pleasure combined because that's like a really good example where it's like, when it's just about money, it's not real.

Like what, what is that like, literally nothing. It's just a number, but when we combine money with pleasure, one, we can have like a really good healing relationship with money, which I think the, the energy and the frequency of money in this world needs a shift in its consciousness. [00:25:00] And I think through doing this kind of work, we do that for a collective basis, but then also in our own life.

But then it also brings it back into the body. It brings it back about the experience. It brings it back to like things that are more important than just how much, right? Although how much can be fun to play with. Not saying that, not, not, not saying that whatever, um, sometimes my grammar goes out the door when I'm on a riff.

Meaghan: you want to hear more on Viola's riff more about that specifically, I listened to your podcast episode, the like pay revolution or whatever, like the money revolution. Um, that episode was great. I mean, it's short and sweet. I think it's like 15, 20 minutes long, but it was, it was really, really great. I loved.

Viola: yeah, exactly. And so it just, it just came to this point where, for me, I'm like, I need to start doing more to break down these concepts and just make people more aware, because I think once we start reflecting, it doesn't matter what we end up doing. It doesn't matter if you do a pay anything or you charge super high amounts, but you're starting to reflect on [00:26:00] why and where in my energy and in my body, do I believe that this is what I should be charging?

Or is this what actually feels good to me? Is this what's allowing me to live how I want, or is this just because this is the standard that everyone else is setting outside of me. So yeah, it really comes back down to that.

Meaghan: Yeah. And I think that's absolutely like our mission on this earth as spiritual entrepreneurs, not even just coaches, but like people who are trying to pave the way in any, in any capacity whatsoever it's to constantly challenge those shoulds and those things that we think we know, and the things that we think are so innate being like, wait, why do I feel that way?

What is evidence that, that, that is true and what might be evidence to the contrary? And, you know, you, you might land on the side of, oh, no, that is true. And I'm gonna stick with that belief because it serves me [00:27:00] and that's, that's what I believe. And you may end up feeling like, oh, maybe I can play with the opposite side of this or a different version of this.

And it can still be just as useful for me in a different way.

Viola: Exactly. Yeah. And, um, don't know it's it is just such an interesting conversation because the whole value thing of how, what we place on ourselves is such a big one. And I think that's like the fear for a lot of people is that if they don't, if they're not always charging more, not that it's just

about that. But I do feel that that's where most people have, the sticky point is about charging more or less, right. That's the sticking point. Um, and it's like, if they don't charge more, then they're not gonna be seen as valued. And I will say that in order to really, because that's not true, that's just like flat out, not true, but it's like in order to really challenge that and change that in our world and to create a money healing in our, in our communities, in our collective, [00:28:00] we have to one be aware of how we, if in this case, charge, um, but also how we look at what other people charge.

Um, and this goes hand in hand with the conversation of hierarchy, which is the episode right after that, on my podcast. And I recorded them next to each other. Um, pricing money revolution, and then the hierarchy conversation. Um, and yeah, and it's about how we're also challenging our own perspective of all of these things in our own business, as well as what, how we're perceiving the other people in our world and in our realms.

Meaghan: Yeah. And it's so interesting that you bring up about you paying your coach and how you always feel like you have to be upleveling just the payment amount, because I literally recorded a podcast episode not long ago, talking about how and why I hired my coach, who I pay $4,000 a month for pleasure money coaching.

And mainly it was because the [00:29:00] money scared the shit out of me. Like it's, that was the stretchy aspect of it. And now. Like, If I knew what was going, the transformation that I was going to have in the program beforehand, it would've been the actual transformation that was more stretchy to me that, that I actually made the decision about because the money is nothing anymore compared to like how different and scary and like edgy my, who I'm becoming is, versus

Viola: Yeah. Mm-hmm

Meaghan: like just the money.

Like the money's nothing like I'm, I'm testing new waters that are way scarier than spending, you know, way more than I ever have before on a coach. Like it's just 

Viola: Right, exactly. And I think, you know, that's one of the beautiful pieces of it. And, and right now, I, I, when I announced this, I said, I'm, I'm gonna play it by ear because you know, I'm, we're gonna talk about human design in a second. I'm a [00:30:00] splenic manifestor like, for me, things are like about initiation.

Pushing. Yeah, exactly. About pushing the limits and trying new things and also knowing what's right for me in a moment, not necessarily like over time. And so for me, I said like, when I get my splenic urge to change it, I'm gonna change it. But I'm playing currently with doing a pay scale for all of my offers.

So even my one on one, which was the one I had to like shift internally the most, because that's where I'm always just like, this is my one on one time. But I, I, I chose a scale where the scale is from, you know, if I had the most epic client who was just like shifting and like we're having the best time with ever what would be like the minimum exchange financially that I would feel like, you know, really good about showing up in that space for? And then what's, what's the max right now?

And so I, I set that scale and how I word it, is just like, you can either invest where you're at or you can challenge yourself and stretch yourself. And it feels really [00:31:00] powerful for me to like hand that power to someone else, because I know, especially when it comes to growth, when it comes to money, um, when we get into a place where we're so uncomfortable that we are no longer embodied, um, we're no longer feeling safe.

It's actually makes it harder sometimes. You know, like sometimes they say like, oh, invest really big. But if we are investing to a point where it puts us out, it can be actually worse in the long run. Um, so it's just really fun for me to play with this idea: for some people that are gonna push themselves to invest the most.

Like whenever I've invested in this sliding scale, I've always invested the top. That's just me. Um, and, and the situations that I was in while I was investing, like I've always been in a really abundant place when those opportunities present, presented themselves. So I always invested at the top, but then I also know there's been, would've been times in my life where that bottom, the bottom end of the scale, would've been like, oh my god, everything for me.

Um, and. I've when I've wanted something I've never [00:32:00] shown up half or I've never not gotten value out of something, just because of the price. Like, if I really want something I'm there.

Meaghan: I love that you said that, first of all, I love that you said that you have shown up because I think there is this narrative in the coaching industry of like, well, if you give something away for free, you're gonna get free effort back. And like, you know, people only show up for things that they pay for which I think in some instances can be true.

But I think that if you are dedicated and devoted to what it is that you are wanting to get out of them. Uh, a program, which I think also takes a little bit of, um, wisdom and maturity in this space. So like maybe when I first started four years ago, I wouldn't know how to hold myself to a container. Now that I've taken been in 10, 15 plus programs at this point, like, I know what I need to do to get out, to get out what I need to [00:33:00] get out from a container.

Viola: Right. Exactly. Yeah.

Meaghan: And then another thing that I wanted to say was I also have a sliding scale for my private coaching as well. And I love the way you worded it way better. And I think I'm gonna change my verbiage now because right now, I have, like, my, the low side of the scale is for you. If you have unmanageable debt or you have less access to resources and all of that kind of stuff, but I love how you put it of like, you know, pay where you're at or stretch yourself, like really see what you can do with your money, because it is all an experiment.

It's all a fun, it's all fun. It's all a game. Like money is money is something that we get to play with and it doesn't have to be so serious. So if you feel like you can play, when you invest into a program, Then more power to you, but if you feel like this is a very, you know, structured, like, okay, [00:34:00] I have to be at this level, then, then you have that option and then you can kind of play with expanding your mind in other ways.

Maybe not expanding your money specifically.

Viola: and also just like as further proof inside of my mastermind, I actually have a huge range of what people paid. Like I, I gave a suggested range, but I left it for whatever. And the only reason I gave the suggested range is because I wanted to give people like, just an idea, because if it was anything, anything, you know, I feel like sometimes that feels even like crazier, but I, I literally had people invest single digits and I had people invest four digits and I was like

you know, I was, I was really disconnecting from how much people pay. So I wasn't, I was seeing the money come in, obviously, cause I get a notification, but I wasn't being like, oh, this person paid this much. It wasn't like that. I was just like welcoming every single person as the, like the only thing I was looking at is they're in the container.

Like I wasn't like they invested this much or they did this or they, I was just like, [00:35:00] you're in, I'm excited. And I can tell you right now, there is no difference in the level of how people are showing up inside the container based on their investment. And in fact, some of the people that paid like around the mid-level have, have done the least, um, which I find really funny, but they're also done the least as in like showed up the least,

but also they're getting out of the container, what they want to get out of the container, right? Like they're showing up for how it feels good for them. One of the people doesn't even wanna be in the chat. They only wanna show up for the calls. Perfect. They invested at that level. Um, and obviously in a group thing, it's a lot, um, a lot different than if it was 1 on 1, but in 1 on 1, it's a different type of client, like, or a different mindset of a client coming in, I think.

But yeah. And so it's just like been really interesting how, like you can see that people like invested what they wanted, what they felt comfortable with, how they felt that they were gonna get value out of the container. And it's really, really cool to see for me and just like validating and proof to everything [00:36:00] that I was feeling and thinking about this concept.

Meaghan: I I'm so excited that you said that because I didn't even think about how, like, subconsciously you might put on to the person who paid the least that like, they're not gonna show up and like, you know, they, all of the things that, that might, um, hint at. Versus like, okay, this is the person that paid the most,

and I need to like, make sure that they're super happy and I need to make sure that like I'm showing up for them and giving them like the VIP experience like that. That is wild because I, I didn't even think about how you might have your own preconceived, like subconscious, um, treatment of the people in your group.

Viola: Yeah, exactly. And that's what I, I really love about it is just, it's just like, it feels so good because just everyone shows up how they want. And I show up for every single person, um, how I would for anyone and it feels fucking awesome. I [00:37:00] just love, and it's like 18 people in the space. It's very vibey, you know, it's very, very cool.

Meaghan: I love it. I'm just like, I'm ecstatic about it. I think it's so cool. This like whole experiment that you did, it's like sparking new things inside me. And if anyone in my audience ends up doing this, please let me know because I wanna know what their experience as well.

Viola: I would love to know too.

Meaghan: Yeah. Okay. So let's move into human design.

Viola: In our last few minutes,

Meaghan: and we're like, uh, almost 45 minutes in Um, okay. So you were talking about your slenic authority. I have, my authority is sacral, so I don't know much about any of the other authorities. So I would just love to hear you talk about the authorities, first of all.

Viola: Okay. First, first I would love to preface human design just for anyone who may be like new to it. Or also just to hear the lens that I kind of teach human design through. Um, and human design's like an energetic system. That's the synthesis of five, um, powerful [00:38:00] modalities that are used around the world and in a lot of other cultures.

So we have, um, the I Ching, we have the, um, chakra system, the Kabbalah, the, um, astrology. And we have, um, quantum physics as well. So it's this combination of all of these really beautiful things that come together and create the human design map or the human design graph and chart, which essentially shows us how our energy interacts with the world around us, with the people around us, how our energy flows the best, like we're kind of,

how we can best manage our energy, I guess. And, um, it was, it was founded kind of like put together by this Canadian, but I really love honoring the systems that it comes from because that's really where the magic of this system comes from. Um, and the, the, what was I gonna say? Oh right. The cool thing about this is, [00:39:00] is that, although there's like five types, 

we are not all of humanity, can't fit into five versions of a person. Like each chart is also incredibly nuanced. Like there, it goes deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper and deeper, um, in terms of how it can be different for every single person. And it's also not meant to tell you how to live. It's supposed to give you an indication of how your energy works in a particular area of your life.

And then for you, it's important for you to play around with that energy and to start to see how that energy, um, impacts you and how you've noticed that, you know, oh, wow. Things are easier when I do it this way. Oh, wow. I do feel more confident in myself. Oh my gosh, that's actually incredibly permission giving for me to understand about myself.

So the experiment, which is what it's called in human design actually takes about seven years, they, say to do a full deconditioning of, um, you know, paying attention to your human [00:40:00] design and experimenting it with your own life, um, really feeling into your own intuition about it, and then coming to a place where you feel in just like effortless alignment with who you're really designed to be.

Um, and I use human design as well as like gene keys and stuff to help people really decondition, like help decondition these like patriarchal concepts, decondition who they think they should be, decondition how they think they should do things, in order to come back to their most aligned frequency where I say that's where abundance is like abundance and success our unique

version of success is the most effortless and easy, because we are who we're designed to be, which at our core, we are abundance and worth and all of these wonderful things that we strive for in our life. So, um, there's five different aura types and all of these aura types have a different way that they interact with the world.

And that's kind of like the biggest umbrella. So if you're looking at your human design for the first time, you'll see, you're either manifesting generator, a generator, which one are you?

Meaghan: I'm a manifesting generator,

Viola: Manifesting generators. So there's those two [00:41:00] types. And I knew that you were one of those because they're the only types that have a defined sacral, which you said you're sacral authority, um, and then there's projectors, manifestors and reflectors.

And, um, they, because the majority of the population are manifesting generators and generators, there's those like smaller percent ones can often be the most conditioned, because I think like a lot of our setup, not that this suits every gen and mani-gen, because I think our world's still set up in a really old school way, which doesn't serve anybody.

Um, but it's like work ethic nine to fives. Like all that stuff is really not possible for some of these other types. I mean, anything's possible, but, um, it's just different. There's more conditioning, I guess, in our work ethic, um, specifically. Um, and then, um, your authority, which is what you mentioned you'd love me to talk about, is how we make decisions.

And more specifically, how your body gives you [00:42:00] clues of what the right decision is for you, which is really cool to know. . Um, so 50% of the population are emotional authority, which means they're here to be emotional beings, which means that you actually naturally have ups and downs in your emotions if you're an emotional authority and, um, you for you, it's about navigating the world and making decisions from a place where you're letting things move through your emotional body before you decide - meaning it's not correct for you to make a decision split in the moment.

Like that is just not how energy moves for you. Um, it is okay to give yourself time. I know a lot of emotional authorities when they hear that it's like a permission slip. They're like, "oh, phew!" Like I don't have to, you know how sometimes in the personal development world they say, oh, leaders make decisions fast,

and like, da, da. It's like, no, like some people do yes, but not everyone. Um, and, um, you'll naturally have these ups and downs. Like the, the kind of saying is never [00:43:00] start anything in a high, never quit anything in a low and, and make your decisions when you get to a neutral place. Um, and that's the emotional authority, which is 50% of the population.

So it's a big one to know. Sacral, for you, is the gut yes and no. So the gut has a really strong yes or no system, even if you're emotional authority, if you're also a generator or manifesting generator, you also do have this. It's just that you also need to work with your emotions, but you'll also have this internal gut yes/no. So, um, It's interesting because this, like, you know, when you talk about like pleasurable money and like this "mmm, like, what am I feeling towards?" Like, I, I just see a lot of like sacral energy in that conversation.

Meaghan: Yeah.

Viola: Um, but essentially the concept is that within your gut, you have a yes or no switch, basically.

So when you get asked yes or no questions, or when you ask yourself yes or no questions, you'll either feel an "Ah-huh," like an [00:44:00] opening a yes, "mm-hmm." Or you'll feel an "Uhuh," like a kind of more constricting, like, "not for me." Like, um, a lot of the sacrals that I know, describe it as like a fire, you know, it's like a fire that gets lit up within them when they get a yes.

It's like, "Ooh, yes," that gives me a, "I gotta do this" energy. Um, so utilizing yes/no questions if you're a sacral authority, is your power. And then we have splenic, which is me. Um, so you can only be splenic if you're a projector or a manifestor and, um, splenic is an intuitive split moment yes. Or, or no. Like the it's

Meaghan: it was kind of softer, right? Like it was much, much, much softer than a sacral, which is like, like fire and it's like splenic, which is how would you describe the splenic?

Viola: So splenic is like, if you imagine like a deer grazing in a field and the deer without seeing anything, without having any physical evidence or proof suddenly just [00:45:00] gets this feeling that it's not safe and it needs to run away. Right? And then turns out lurking in the bushes was a tiger or a lion, or I don't know, a predator.

And, um, they never had external proof. They may never even know that that was there, but they just knew they had to get out of there. So it's very instinctual and it's based around safety. So it's actually, "no" is a lot more obvious to a splenic than a, than a "yes." So no's often come up and it's just like, you're at a party and suddenly it's just like, I don't know why, but I just gotta go.

I wanna go home like that feeling. Or, um, you walk into a room and it's just like, not the energy. Like I love having splenic authority for looking at houses cuz I literally walk in the door and my splenic authority will tell me straight away if this is the house for me or not. Um, and so, or like cars or those kinds of things, like it can be confusing.

All, all of us basically like with authority, the, the big thing it's teaching us is that we don't make decisions from our mind. We make decisions from [00:46:00] our body. Right. And so when we bring things up to our mind, we get confused. But something like a sacral authority, like you could kind of like re- rebalance yourself and then ask yourself some yes/no questions. For a splenic,

if I bring something up to my head, I've already lost. Like it's, thought's not ever gonna tell me again what the answer was. And so when it's a yes though, or it's not, it doesn't work necessarily like a yes/no, it works more like maybe an idea. It's like a very soft whisper. It's like a, like the, the mastermind for me, I could have missed it if I wasn't paying attention to pay what you want thing.

Right. It was just like, "do a pay-what-you-want mastermind pspspsps." And I was like, wait, what was that? Did I hear pay what you want mastermind? Mm, probably was nothing. And then I was like, actually, you know what, maybe this is something. And then I went with it, you know? And now I'm just like, oh my god, how could I have nearly missed that?

This has been like huge. Um, but yeah, so it's a very, very subtle, um, yes/no. And then after that we get into the projector only authority or wait, actually, the manifestor can still have [00:47:00] these next ones don't mind me. So the, the ego authority is one that's basic- I'm gonna go through these fast - one because they're way less of the population, but two, because there's so many.

So the ego motivation is all about, um, Uh, all about like what you want aligning what's right with your heart. What, what feels like what you really want and desire. It's very much based around your own desire and this one, as well as the next ones that I'm gonna mention talking it out is incredibly important.

So it's important for you to be able to like, have an environment where you're talking about something like a sounding board, not somebody that's gonna tell you what to do, but somebody who can just listen. And within that, as you talk, you're seeing what feels like what I want the most, what feels like what is like my most desire.

And then with the next one, which is self projected, you're doing the same thing, but you're listening to what feels like me. What feels like this is who I am. This is like my identity. This is really truly encompassing who I [00:48:00] am. The next one, which is sometimes called none or mental or environmental, um, Is essentially like you have, have no clear indicator in your body.

So it is really very much about the sounding board. It's about giving yourself space to talk about it and seeing what it feels like in your environment and that kind of thing with all of these, people often notice like an either contract contracting or opening in the heart. So sometimes that can be a cue, but you yourself will have to play around with it to see what's best.

And then the final one is the lunar authority, which is, um, reserved for reflectors only. And this is basically, um, they need to move through a lunar cycle to really truly know what's right for them. And now whenever I get to this point, people say, "but what? A reflector has to wait 28 days to make any decision?"

Yes. But it's not as complicated as you think, because one, every single day, a new thing could, um, be kind of activating. But also this [00:49:00] is not about what to eat. This is not about simple things. This is about like lifestyle changes, big decisions, where to go. And also what I'll notice a lot, like for example, my mastermind has three reflectors in it and I only did like a five day launch or something for it.

So it's like, how did reflectors make that decision? A reflector might already have decided they wanna do this work. A reflector might have already decided that they're like ready for the thing. And then when my thing popped up, they're like, this is what I've been looking for. This is exactly what I've already been aligning with.

You know? So, I mean, that's it in a nutshell.

Meaghan: Super quick and dirty. I love that. Oh my gosh. I that's fascinating. I love the ego authority that feels like something I might have had in the past life.

Viola: If you have a defined, um, uh, do you know, do you know your chart off the top of your head?

Meaghan: I don't. I mean, I have it saved, but I don't know, like what's defined and what's not, I, I [00:50:00] worked with a coach a couple years ago and she got human design readings for all of her clients. So that's kind of how I got mine. Um, but yeah, I could, we could talk about it after, but

Viola: So the, if you do have a defined heart, which I'm just gonna say this on the audio. So like I'll show you on the picture here that the defined heart is this one here, the small one, if it's red, that's a defined heart, which means that you have that same energy. It's just not, it's just not the primary thing that your, how your body's giving you cues, you know?

Um, and everyone experiences the energy, whether you have the center open or closed as well, so closed center, so if your color centers are colored in on your chart, it means that you have an internal, consistent access to it. If it's white, it means that you are amplifying energy from the world. And so a lot of the times in those centers, um, if you have them open, you are, that's actually where you're meant to become wise.

That's where you're gonna gather your wisdom. And you're actually gonna be able to [00:51:00] share that wisdom with the world, right? For me, like I have an, an undefined sacral center. Part of my wisdom is knowing when to stop working, when to know when enough is enough, when to know when to keep going. Like learning that, because when it comes to like, go, go, go, go, go energy.

I'm completely open. I'm picking it up from the world around me. So I'm always thinking I gotta keep going. I gotta keep going. I keep going. When in reality, I need to learn to slow down and stop. Right? Um, and then that becomes my wisdom. And so it's, we all experience the energy. It's just, we're learning different things from the energy, I guess you can say.

Meaghan: Yeah, I've definitely heard that about like the, the way that you can make money or the way your magic comes, is from your undefined centers, because you are learning how to cultivate those. Your defined centers are things that come naturally to you that you couldn't necessarily teach to someone else because you've never had to [00:52:00] learn it in the first place.

Viola: Yeah. And, and it's also like, it's, it's kind of like an energy that you are, um, also like an example in, or like, you know, something like that. Like people might look up to you for that energy and they might witness you in that energy. Um, but yeah, it's, it's like, it gets so nuanced. It's so interesting. And there's so many different things to share.

And so like if you're new to human design, the first thing you wanna learn about is your aura. So manifesting generator projector or whatever, um, then with each aura comes a strategy. So there's always a strategy linked to an aura. So that talks about like how to make sure that your, your energy is flowing correctly in a, in like the community, in the world.

Um, and then the authority, like how you make decisions. Those are like, if you think about like astrology big three, this is your human design, big three, um, your type strategy and authority. And, and you wanna learn those because before anything else is gonna [00:53:00] like, make sense in your chart or like, you're gonna really understand how to work with that energy.

You have to first be checked in with this because you know, like, let's say for example, you have an open sacral. For me, I'm always checking in like with my splenic authority to check that that's correct. I'm making sure that I'm acting like a manifestor to make sure that I'm like understanding that energy correctly.

So everybody's gonna have a different take on that. Um, but those are the first big three, but then if you wanna play around, like looking at your open centers is really fun because that's where you can learn probably where you're the most conditioned from your environment. And, um, yeah, that's, I think a really, really fun places to start.

Meaghan: Yeah, I, at the beginning, you, uh, you mentioned that human design gives you a huge permission slip and I've, I've truly found that to be true about when I learned that about manifesting generators and how you are allowed to just pick up and drop whatever [00:54:00] feels good to you in the moment, you're allowed to have lots of things going on and, and not finish things and, and kind of be all over the place.

That to me was so freeing because I always felt like a quitter. I always felt like I couldn't stick things to the end. I always had this very negative opinion about myself and my projects, and since learning about human design and I know very little, I know very little about human design, but since learning about manifesting generators, it has really given me a lot of permission to just be myself.

Viola: Mm-hmm . Yep, exactly. And that's like, that's one of the most common things I hear manifesting generators say, and there's also your profile lines is the other thing I'll encourage you to look into if you're new to it. But I love working with profile lines too. They're very, very, um, freeing. And also like for me as a manifestor when I first learned about it, um, I actually resisted it a little bit because I actually thought I wasn't a manifesting generator, but it's [00:55:00] interesting cuz I have two manifesting generator parents and I, I think that a lot of my identity of being a manifesting generator came from being raised

with two parents who are very, very much MGs and then, but then when I started to actually like, realize it, that's when I felt such a permission slip, because for me as a manifestor, similar to, to you in the sense of like having all these random projects that you pick up and put down, it's kind of the same thing.

But for me, my energy, like I'll go through, um, rest periods and they can be like an indefinite amount of time, a rest period where, where I literally don't have the energy or motivation to do anything. And, um, what I used to do is I used to push myself to keep working and do things in those periods, because I would think that obviously you have to be consistent.

You have to keep working, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I would burn out and then I would get sick. And I would be like, basically forced to take rest time cuz I would be sick and I would still try to work when I was sick. [00:56:00] Like I was just like hyper crazy about work. Like I was hustle, the definition of hustle at that point.

Um, but yeah. Then when I learned I was a man, a manifestor, I was like, oh, damn, like, this is really interesting. So I started to play around with that and I, and I started to give myself like really work on like learning how to rest, like literally, how do you rest? I also have ADHD. So it's like, literally how and, um, So that was like a really big learning curve for me, but it's so important for manifestors to take rest when they need rest, because in order for that next initiation, for that next idea for that next aligned thing you're meant to be doing to come through, it's almost like you need to like, get a clear slate and then you'll like download the new, the new idea.

And then suddenly you'll have this creative burst of energy, much like ADHD actually. And then you'll be like, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And you'll do a lot very, very, very quickly. Um, so you'll do like maybe a month's work in just a few days. Um, [00:57:00] but you wouldn't have been able to do that if you'd been pushing yourself beyond your limits,

um, that whole time.

Meaghan: Yeah. I love that. And, um, we're gonna have to get on another podcast episode because, I think we're at time, but I wanna know. Um, how do you, how do you use human design in your offerings? Like, do you offer readings or do you do them more in like your private coaching, like in your coaching containers?

Viola: I do readings on and off. The reason that I don't do readings just regularly is because one, I only do them when I get the splitting urge to do them. And sometimes I really just wanna talk about human design and other times less so, but I also really love working alongside people. Because as you know, when you have a reading, you'll maybe latch onto one thing, which is great.

Um, but I really love to give people like real time examples of what's happening. Oh, this is this part. And here you can experiment with this and maybe try it this way. And so I love actually actively working [00:58:00] with people. Um, and so human design is integrated in all of my work. Like when you work with me, it's like, cool, like exchange payment, gimme your human design info.

Let's go , you know, like that's and I also use gene keys, which is powerful, but I'm basically, um, looking at how you can really step into like, like fine tune your energy so that you're not responding to the world around you in terms of who you should be. And coming back to your own energy, finding new ways to do things for yourself, giving yourself more permission, like working with your shadows, working with your gifts, like all these different things.

And so mastermind one on one. That's really easy, cuz it's just real time as we go. And then in programs I might be like, you know, like for example, I did like Cosmic Wealth Personified, which was like gene keys, human design, and money. And so in there I'm like talking about concepts of money and all the things to do with that program.

But then I'm like giving people like a specific thing to look at in their chart and be like, if you have this, this is what it means for you. If you have that, this is [00:59:00] what it means for you. So integrate it into everything. Cause I just. that, now that I know about our individuality, it's like, I can't not cater to it.

Meaghan: Yeah, I love that. I wanna start, I wanna start doing the same thing that coach that I had a couple years ago is, was doing by getting the readings, because I think it is so important to know the person you're dealing with. And

Viola: Oh, for sure.

Meaghan: I mean, I tend, as a manifesting generator, I tend to attract a ton of manifesting generators, but I can't coach everyone the same way 

I would coach a manifesting gen a manifesting generator. I can't just say, listen to your, listen to your gut and let it tell you yes or no, you know?

Viola: I know, and I like, I, I mean, I had only MG coaches actually for the first part of my business. And then when I took a break from having coaches, I realized like, oh, damn, like not that anything they taught me was wrong or like bad or anything like that. [01:00:00] It's just that I real, like, I know my human design and I, you know, so I filter what I'm told, but I still was like, oh yeah, that was very MG advice,

that really doesn't suit me. But I took it on at the beginning because especially at the very start of my business, because I was just like trying to learn as much as I could. So I would sometimes question, you know, is this really, is this correct for everyone? Maybe I'm just, you know, as a manifestor blah, blah.

And so later, like now when I get coaches, I'm just like don't ever give me advice or tell me what to do.

Meaghan: Yeah.

Viola: I'm just like, unless I ask you, like, unless I say, can you please give me your thoughts or your advice or something on this? Other than that, just be my mirror. Tell me what I'm telling you. Just like, that's it.

Meaghan: Ask me. Good questions. That's all I need to all I

Viola: yeah, exactly.

Just, you know, guide me don't ever give me suggestions or ideas because that's how I end up responding, which isn't correct for my energy. Right.

Meaghan: Yeah. I have a friend who created a whole course just for manifesting generators. And I thought [01:01:00] that was really, really cool.

Viola: yeah.

Meaghan: Um, I'm not I'm I, I assume that she's a manifesting generator too, which is why she did that, but I, I'm not sure for sure.

Viola: mm-hmm yeah, it is really nice when you can get into a group of people who have the same, like aura energy as you, because everyone's like resonating and whatever, I'm actually gonna be hosting something for manifesters soon. Um, and then, yeah, but I'm excited.

Meaghan: Well, thank you so much for your time today, Viola. Um, can people still get into your mastermind or is it closed? What have you got going on?

Viola: So it was supposed to be a one time only thing it's closed, just because we're already halfway through it. But, um, I'm getting a lot of questions. I'm getting a lot of people who are like, wait, what is this thing that you're doing? Um, and so I've opened, yeah, I've opened an expression of interests form, um, that I have, or people can just DM me [01:02:00] and I, and I'm really excited about the potential of doing another one just because this has been so like it's blown my mind.

It's probably been one of the best masterminds I've ever hosted, to be honest. Um, No, it definitely is. It's so good. So good. And I just love, um, like just the concept of how the mastermind's set up, but then also what we cover in the mastermind is really like, the conversation are just so powerful. So I'm thinking of doing it again.

Um, but nothing set in stone yet.

Meaghan: Of course. Well, thanks again. And we'll have you on again, I'm sure, to talk more about human design, just human design. I will have no other questions. Actually, I can't promise that, but,

Viola: Well maybe next time. We'll talk about human design first.

Meaghan: Right, right, right. That's yeah.

Viola: yeah,

Meaghan: Good, good idea. All right. Well thank you so much. We'll talk soon. Okay.

Viola: No problem.

Meaghan: Bye.

Viola: later.

PODCAST OUTRO:

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